About this article
This is a collection of persistent voices with regards to YTPMV/Otomads, to which we voiced our honest reactions – not to condemn them, but rather, to encourage you to confront and discuss the topics.
The ghastly echoes of hot takes resonate in the underground… Those who have lingered for long can recount the everlasting undertows. For it isn’t pretty, we shan’t tread recklessly…
“We have to gatekeep! Don’t appropriate my underground culture!”
There is a small contrarian part of my brain that activates whenever a work makes it too big. I guess the sentiment is born out of frustration from the fact that the broader internet seems to universally love YTPMV whenever a repost blows up, but never really seeks it out.
This leads to situations where many quotes become sort of trigger-words for people active in the community, things like “YTPMV is so back” or “I miss when people made stuff like this”. – We never left in the first place!
I’m also guilty of this, just don’t let it turn you into an asshole I suppose.
Every art form / genre is going to start between some kind of like-minded group, and by that point often times it won’t even recognize it’s starting anything, but rather adding to an existing form or genre.
It’s easy to forget that YTP started just 20 years ago, and YTPMV started a few years after, in 2007. Since its very recent inception, and through naturally shrouding itself from most public eyes and opinions (as it was kept online when far less people used the internet compared to today), it was allowed to form a very strong identity and passionate community (often times, overly so).
This strong sense of identity, and roots of making things for passion only, clashes with the recent boom of popularity in video creation and online media interest - gatekeeping is a natural response to that, but is ultimately something you grow out of.
We are all a continuation of remix culture / remix art, and so as Michael Jean Jarre or Art of Noise wouldn’t mind us, we shouldn’t mind newcomers either.
It’s a hard mindset to grow out of, but you’d be glad you got over it.
A subculture will inevitably die without new blood. I’m personally conflicted about this, I try to “appeal, but not broadly”.
I understand seeing newer creators making videos that aren’t up to the same quality standards we seasoned creators have and feeling like we need to “gatekeep” source material or aspects of the community to prevent “bad” videos like that from happening. It’s a natural response. But the truth is that every newcomer deserves collab invites and access to resources because if we keep them in the dark, they’ll never grow. We all found our way one way or another.
I started making videos when I was 10, of course I did embarrassing things and used sources without fully understanding them! But that period of finding my style and figuring out how to do this properly is why I’m able to produce works I can be proud of today. Everybody deserves that chance, and I find a lot of enjoyment in watching creators grow and improve over time.
“You will never measure up to the old greats. So stop trying!”
It is best to carve your own path and stop letting peer pressure like that to get to you. Those old creators had clear vision and a strong work ethic, but they were mostly thinking of making something great to show to people. Now it’s your turn!
Nothing wrong with grabbing some inspiration from them, though!
Great accomplishments should be used as inspiration, not as a deterrent. I did once see someone tweet about how a high-grade collab made them wonder if it was even worth continuing with YTPMV… It’s a shame.
I don’t think people should see high-quality work as the ultimate goal of YTPMV. That said, don’t overcompensate. It’s also sad to get cynical about YTPMV/Otomads and act like it’s a nothing-hobby.
There’s an important distinction between inspiration and comparison. While taking notes from the great creators who stood before us can be extremely helpful, putting yourself up against your favorite creators for direct comparison is very unhealthy.
Understanding and accepting that you have your own way is an important step in a creator’s journey. It’s also important not to be discouraged by the heights reached by other creators.
While it may not seem like it, there’s room for innovation everywhere. This is still a young medium. If you choose to make it your own instead of imitating someone else, you have the potential to make history.
“What even is otoMAD/YTPMV?”
Practically recontextualizing media in video form. It’s a direct continuation of the remix art movement except this time incarnated from the nerd culture of online communities.
I see it as a form of collage. We take existing media and cut it up and mix it around to recontextualize it, in both musical and visual ways. It’s similar to YTP in the way that we can derive new meaning and humor from existing media by cutting and altering them, but it adds a musical element as well that lends itself to a very cohesive experience.
…Was that a little too complicated? Basically we make meme remixes.
Seeing is probably better than telling, when you watch one, you can probably tell it is one, and that’s worth a million words. I think some important aspects include sampling and transformation.
One thing that I really like about the medium is the way that it gives some sources a “second life”. A person has deemed that this song, this commercial, or this anime is “complete”, that it has served its purpose as a work of art or product. But then, someone else on the internet will look at it and say “actually, it’s not over, I think I’d like to say something more with this”.
Musical audiovisual remixes, in essence. While there are distinctions and difference in styles, etc., between the two they both feel very much like an evolution of classic Flash/YTMND content…
Frankly, an all-encompassing definition has not yet appeared, as every attempt at answering this question seems to miss the mark at some turns… One can very well argue that the blurry definition is what has allowed the medium to thrive. Everyone has their own understanding as to what it is; so perhaps develop your own, and try to communicate your ideas.
Here’s a classic attempt though: If it has a story to tell, it is otoMAD. If every instrument is being covered, it is YTPMV. These days, people sometimes use it to describe the origin of a video (i.e. YTPMVs are all from YouTube. otoMADs are all from Niconico).
“So… what’s the difference between otoMAD and YTPMV?”
Other than the difference in focus for audio vs. focus on visuals, otoMADs have the appeal of inherently being taken more seriously and usually aim for a polished and complete video presentation (despite a perception to the contrary in the more general Japanese public who aren’t so familiar with the medium!), while YTPMVs are hinged on the nonchalant aspect, and aesthetic through carelessness. – Having YTPMV’s origins in mind, and even just having “YTP” in the damn name should be obvious enough to why that is the case. YTP started as effortless mock commentary through video recontextualization. From the very start, it never took itself very seriously and those roots project til this day - and I think that’s great.
Remix culture always was a big middle finger to large media publishing by taking it and making it your own. That being said, there’s a style for everyone, and I’m convinced you’d be able to find a good amount of creators you enjoy from either communities.
There are lots of ways to split hairs about the definition, and I think the distinction can vary between creators and what they aim to achieve from drawing that line.
Here is my personal take: It depends on whether the author is trying to recreate (YTPMV) or complement (otoMAD) the BGM. I believe each mindset influences how they approach their mixing, storytelling, and other aspects of their work.
After two decades of cultural exchange, these two subcultures appear very similar on the surface.
At first it was easy to discern based on the sentencing/video style (i.e. otoMADs had freestyle sentencing, while YTPMVs relied on track covers.) However, in modern times you have videos that sound like YTPMVs calling themselves otoMADs and vice-versa, so the definition is very muddy now.
It would be easier to just slap a massive over-generalized label that covers any and all remixes! This harks back to the otaku debate of whether animations that call themselves ‘anime’ can be classified as such or should the label only be given to shows coming out of Japan. (I’m in the latter camp!)
Ultimately, the distinction between the two is arbitrary. After so much open communication and influence between the two communities, they’ve more or less merged and there really is no concrete definition of what determines the category a work falls into.
It is true that there are general trends, like the source material used and the style of the video, but it doesn’t really matter which is which as long as everyone knows what you’re talking about. Hell, there are a lot of videos I would say qualify as both. I would personally consider myself a YTPMVer, but I’ve felt differently about that in the past, and may feel differently about it in the future. Who knows?
Indeed, it doesn’t really matter! They double as signatures for members of the community to recognize each other in the wild!
“YTPMVs are boring and require no skill! Otomads are superior in every way!”
There’s a lot to be said about the disconnect between YTPMV and Otomad authors, the references, jokes, and popular sources are widely different, but I don’t think both should be weighed on a scale, it’s fine to prefer one genre without antagonizing the other half of the community, and while I lean more toward Otomads, there are definitely great YTPMVs to be found.
I’m often very impressed by YTPMVs, even as someone who primarily works with otoMADs. For example, the amount of work going into videos like this one is truly staggering.
It’s true that the lines are very blurred between YTPMV and otoMAD, yet here I am now using the two terms assuming that you would understand the differences!
Variety is the spice of life, while I lean towards more chaotic otoMADs, sometimes I feel like taking it easy and listen to a soothing YTPMV. In addition, I’m an English speaker and YTPMVs have an easier time making me laugh when they include jokes.
While “only” covering every track is technically simpler, I believe the fun of YTPMV lies in both the way you refine your audio and samples to sound pleasing, and the challenge of making a visually memorable work.
Indeed, with the difference between the two genres being blurry enough already, it’s impossible to have one be objectively better than the other. Just like with art or music, the style you prefer is up to your subjective taste, and those tastes can change over time as well.
Every style of otoMAD and YTPMV brings something different to the table and is valid. I prefer sources associated with YTPMV but lean more towards otoMAD styles. It doesn’t have to be black and white!
“The medium cannot be legitimized because it relies on unauthorized sampling. It’s STEALING!”
I genuinely believe it when I say that works in this medium are a transformation of the source material.
Isn’t all art derivative in some way? Stories reference and build off of other stories, art is inspired by elements and movements in other art, modern music is based on structures pioneered by musicians from centuries ago. While the source material is more prevalent in YTPMV, it’s still an artistic transformation that turns both the subject and the music from it’s original form into something new.
Remix art exists in part to take back ownership on means of art creation from large soulless corporations. It’s about empowering the individual to express themselves artistically, to develop an eye ear and taste for things - it’s about claiming back a part of the human experience that is often only experienced passively - it’s about creating over consuming. Wake tf up.
Can you imagine if Comiket wasn’t allowed to exist?
“We should keep politics out of this business…”
I fully believe this is a medium where anything goes, but you should always keep in mind not everyone will see your vision if you make a “political work” or use political sources. Are you prepared for people to think you’re making a statement even if there is none? I’d like to live in a world where the author’s intent is all that matters, but that’s probably not realistic.
I suppose it’s important to at least give some thoughts to “what would happen if this video hit the mainstream?”. I’ll admit that it pains me a little to have to provide this kind of consideration while the broader world doesn’t seem to care about Otomads in the slightest.
It’s often said that everything is political whether you like it or not. The creative process itself is often heavily tied to value judgments. If you believe that art is a form of expression, then you better believe it could get political.
That said, we don’t live in a vacuum, and there are consequences to one’s expression, which should at least cross your mind.
As long as you’re having fun, then any and all sources are valid. Try to stay true to yourself. However, there is one (tangentially related) thing that I think should be kept away from your work, and that’s spite. If you make something out of spite, it shows, and leaves a disgusting aftertaste.
Personally, I think bringing in politics is only fun when it’s apolitical. Politicians, world leaders, and public figures have all done so many funny things throughout history it would be a shame to not sample them, but the moment someone starts incorporating genuine political messaging into their video I immediately lose interest, regardless if I agree or disagree.
YTPMVs and otoMADs are supposed to be fun and absurdist, so sources that are used spitefully to mock any sort of political opinion or group really sullies the watching experience for me.
“[Software XYZ] is the better way to do it, you should switch!”
It’s good to be aware of options and tradeoffs. Let people know that options exist, and if it can solve a particular problem they are facing, tell them about it. It’s not like you have to jump ship anyways, you can always figure out a way to integrate only the parts you need in your workflow.
Unless I have to pry open your project files, I do not care how you render the final product.
At the end of the day, what you use comes down to what you’re most comfortable with. You could even make audio in Audacity and visuals in Capcut… and if that’s what works for you, then keep it up!
For me, even though in a lot of ways REAPER is better for audio and After Effects is better for visuals, I’ve stuck with Vegas Pro the whole time and can’t see myself switching any time soon. I’m aware of the limitations of Vegas, but choose to live with them because this is the software I’m most comfortable with. And when I do run into those hard limitations, I don’t have any issues with doing a small scene in Blender or doing some vocals in VocalShifter. Everybody has their own process, try things and see what sticks!
You should learn the fundamentals rather than any particular tool! There is a vast amount of principles and ideas that always apply regardless of the software of choice.
“You must be MEAN with criticism, no one takes it seriously otherwise.”
You shouldn’t try to make other people make videos the way you want to make yours.
Please try to make it obvious that you’re making an argument in good faith.
Rather, “you should always be open to constructive criticism”, to which I’ll say: be mindful of the occasion and context when giving criticism, sometimes people are just not in the right mood for it.
Many forget that constructive criticism has to actually be constructive if you truly want to make a difference. If you’re using criticism as an excuse to be mean or rude, it’s automatically invalidated way more than criticism that’s “too soft” ever could be.
If you’re going to offer someone constructive criticism, don’t just tell them what’s wrong, try to also tell them what could fix it.
Sharing your knowledge is the best thing you can do if you want to contribute to a creator’s growth. It’s also important to note that not every creator is actively searching for criticism. What may be a challenge to some is discouragement to others, so please be delicate when offering your critiques to fellow creators.
“The skills aren’t transferable… It’s just not worth the time.”
It’s a technically intense creative hobby and you’re going to learn a LOT of life lessons from even just working on collabs let alone your own videos. It’s a stepping stone to any type of creative work, not just video - there’s a bunch of YTPMVers in the game, music, and film industry that have just moved on from YTPMV entirely so the current community doesn’t know they’re there - but they are. I think a good 80% of my old YTPMV friend group still do creative work and some even straight up work in creative media (which is immensely hard these days).
I personally believe that otoMAD/YTPMV is one of the best hobbies you can get into while you’re young and have a lot of free time. While YTPMV itself isn’t really profitable, you learn such a wide variety of skills. Audio engineering, music theory, art/composition principles, motion graphics, even 3D modeling and programming for some people… a YTPMV creator has many career options.
I’m very lucky that I stumbled into this rabbit hole so early on in my life, as I can imagine few other hobbies that teach you such a varied and industry applicable skill set. The skills I’ve picked up doing this seep into everything I do, from art to video editing to music.
I’ve even heard testimonies of how making audio gave someone a unique perspective on sound-design that was even acknowledged by a relative in that field. As for me, messing around with expressions in AE is basically what eventually led me down the path of programming…
Creating otoMAD/YTPMV requires such a deep skill set and has a near limitless ceiling that it’s no surprise eventually shifting careers away from it can be very natural progression.
Not gonna lie, this sounds like something straight from someone who has not attempted to create much (not just otoMADs). Most things you learn will end up transferring to another creative field, the soft skills you learn are truly invaluable. After all, the best method of learning is to have fun.
This statement also completely ignores that having an artistic hobby is incredibly healthy in itself. Even though it may seem silly at first, YTPMV is a form of art and self-expression, and after hard days at work or finally making it to the weekend, chipping away at a new video and putting it all together can feel extremely rewarding and rejuvenating.
If pastimes with non-transferable skills were considered not worth the time, then nobody would play games or watch movies.
“How could you monetize the videos to make a career out of it?”
It’s technically possible, even if some may feel that it’s a morally gray zone, but besides the scorn from other users you will probably just ruin the fun of making these videos for yourself. I think you should keep it as a hobby.
I hear VTubers are really warming up to similar sorts of work! – On the other hand, it’s not always good for a hobby to turn into a full-time job. I’ve seen people try and burn out, even prolific creators who seemed to have all the right cards in hand. I just don’t think the effort/reward ratio is really worth it.
It’s a fool’s errand really. Monetization on online platforms is already unpredictable and dodgy as it is, trying to do it for a media that inherently remixes existing content with copyright systems as awful as we have them online nowadays - I wouldn’t bother. If you picked up YTPMV as a hobby, maybe just accept you’re doing it for a very small audience and have fun within it.
Still, it’s possible to use the skills you’ve acquired to edit videos for other independent creators, which is something I’ve seen happen a bunch.
All the creators who make notable money from their videos have had to make a lot of sacrifices. You have to start following trends, pandering to general audiences, tracking analytics, uploading constantly. This often leads to a loss of artistic identity. When your art becomes work determined by an algorithm, are you really expressing yourself or are you just clocking into a job?
This may seem harsh, but when talking about those who chose to heavily monetize their content, I always feel that they’ve “sold their soul to YouTube”. And while that is an exaggeration, I really do think that the soul of their work is often lost after this pivot.
With that being said, and this may be an alarming take, I don’t think it’s necessarily evil to involve money in your work. Taking commissions, donations, or something like Patreon… as long as you’re not sacrificing the integrity of your work for it, I don’t think there’s harm in a little extra money on the side. But if you ever want to make notable income, it’s just not possible in this field without giving up your dignity as an artist.
“This whole list is full of strawman arguments. People who’d have such extreme opinions are not worth listening to in the first place. Don’t make up issues!”
Being around since YTPMV started till now - I’ve heard arguments very close to the ones on here.
They’re definitely a bit abrasive… But I also think they’re manifestations of quieter undertones that occasionally appear in the community and even in myself.
Sure, I haven’t had anyone come up and say those straight to me, but when I’m deep in the trenches, working on a project, I may sometimes ask myself what I’m doing this for. I can’t pretend to have the right answers, but I think just the act of facing and acknowledging them can have a positive impact on your approach to the craft.
These ideas are extreme, but some of them are more common than you would think, amongst those who spend years immersed in this world and become cynical or nihilistic. I think discussions about these arguments are important however, because questioning them helps us identify what it is about this community that we love, or can change, or can improve.
Talking about YTPMV is just as important as making it. If we never had discussions or shared ideas, nobody would be inspired! I think a lot of people in the field are struggling with their own thoughts on the medium, and I hope reading some of the replies here helped them solidify their own opinions. If even one person who read this felt like they’ve learned something about the process, then it’s absolutely worth it.